August 17, 2010

Rapture Rebuttal from The Threshing Floor

FROM http://threshingfloor-radio.com/wp-content/uploads/Rapture-Rebuttal.pdf

Rapture Rebuttal

Take them NOT OUT of the world.

We do not want to be taken but rather left. They knew not and the flood came and TOOK them away. If one does a word study on left and taken applying the full weight of scripture, they will find they do not want to be the one that is taken. I assure you of this.

The rapture goes against the FULL WEIGHT of scripture. When hirelings take a few verses from the Scriptures then convolute them, to come up with a pleasant fleshly message, this message will be the complete opposite of what the bible teaches us. That is why first off, NO VERSE IS OF ANY PRIVATE INTERPRETATION. In other words you can't take one verse in scripture and beat down 20 other verses in scripture. They do this with Matthew 13-33 for example. False prophets try to extract a reading that is not in harmony with the scriptures. God will reveal through the Holy Spirit His true meaning of His word if we desire to receive the love of the truth. 2 Thes 2

This is why we are to study to show ourselves approved. We study and rightly divide the word of God.

2 Peter 1:20
Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

2 Timothy 2:15
Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Hosea 4:6
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy
children.

John 17
14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world,
even as I am not of the world.
15 (((I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world))), but that thou shouldest keep
them from the evil.
16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
17 (((Sanctify them through thy truth))): thy word is truth.
18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.
19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be (((sanctified through the truth))).

My Commentary
VS-- 15 Jesus prays that we should NOT be taken out of this world.
VS --17 This verse is huge, the sanctification through the TRUTH is our purging process. This can not happen if we are raptured or taken out of the world.
VS-- 18 we are sent into this world just for that very purpose. We are to be in the world but NOT of the world.
VS-- 19 This is for OUR SAKES. Just as God cursed the ground for Adams SAKE. Adam went through this purging process as well. This is how we are SANCTIFIED. One part of the sanctification is, if one is still believing in lies then that person is not yet sanctified.

GEN ch 3
17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: (((cursed is the ground for thy sake))); in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
18 (((Thorns also and thistles))) shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the (((herb of the field)));
VS 18 Thorns Thistles (serpents scorpions) the herb is the (MULTITUDES) who are led through the fire. (purging)

This on a physical layer of reading is in order to grow food, Adam would have to deal with thorns and thistles, to get to the herb out of the ground to eat. ---(thorns and thistles) 2 parts cut off. The herb is LEFT for consumption and nutrition. When the 2 parts are cut off (the unrighteous), then the third part the RIGHTEOUS are consumed in Christ. As we are joined with HIM at the wedding feast.

John ch 18
37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. (((Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice))).
38 Pilate saith unto him, (((What is truth?))) And when he had said this, he went out again unto the Jews, and saith unto them, I find in him no fault at all.
39 But ye have a custom, that I should release unto you one at the passover: will ye therefore that I release unto you the King of the Jews?
40 Then cried they all again, saying, Not this man, but Barabbas. Now Barabbas was a robber.

Notice in verse 38-- What is truth?-- Jesus does not even bother to even answer pilot. Because he just told him in verse 37. THEY HEAR NOT THE TRUTH!!!

Now back to John 17. This is why Jesus prayed NOT to take them out of the world. Some of them through tribulation (fire) will hear the truth. These are the multitudes who come to the truth. This is not possible if they get RAPTURED. The purging process is trials and tribulation.

Explanation is in John 18-40.

They STILL TODAY as well as then do not want Jesus (TRUTH) - They want their own comfortable religion in exchange for Jesus. They want BARABBAS!!! The rapture is just another version of the multitudes wanting Barabbas. They only want to keep the name Jesus, they LOVE NOT THE TRUTH of the real JESUS CHRIST of the FINISHED WORKS ON THE CROSS.

Why are we so special that we don't get the same suffering the world has received for 6000 yrs? Even starting with Adam. I can tell you why for the same reason they told Jesus in the temple (we are not in bondage) we are of Abraham. (the Rapture crowd thinks they are pure and not in need of any trials) they have no sin. Jesus tells them they really are in the church of Laodocia in REV CH 3-17. (naked)

Revelation 3:17
Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

INSTEAD THEY SHOUT-- GIVE US BARABBAS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

THEY WANT ANY THING EXCEPT THE TRUTH.

I would suggest reading Foxes book of Martyrs. Where was there Rapture?
http://www.sacred-texts.com/chr/martyrs/fox101.htm

--- end ---

Watchmen Weekly
http://threshingfloor-radio.com/index.php/category/radio-shows/watchmen-weekly/

The Third Great Awakening
http://www.thirdgreatawakening.org/BeastWatch.htm

13 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hi Cathy, hey I am all for post tribulation rapture of the church, because that is what the scripture says. Especially in Rev 20:4-6, there it speaks of the first resurrection. Those who participate in the first resurrection are those who were beheaded for not taking the mark of the beast. So by the process of elimination the rapture (since it is a resurrection - the dead in christ rise first, then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up [raptured - the latin vulgate] to meet them in the clouds. 1 Thess 4. So all this business about a 7 seven year pre tribulation or mid tribulation rapture is a bunch of poppy cock. it is english and american cotton candy theology. not founded on any scripture in the bible. even 2 Thess 2 is very straight forward that day can not come unless the great falling away happens and the man of lawlessness is revealed. "That day" refers back to 1 Thess 4 where both ideas occur. The phrase the "coming of the Lord" is found in 1 Thess 4:15 and the "gathering together" refers to the rapture on the clouds in 1 Thess 4:17. This agrees with Jesus' teaching in Matt 24:31 that he comes in the clouds at the end of the age and every eye will see him. So if Paul, John and Jesus all agree that the rapture = resurrection happens at the end of the great tribulation then the crazy pre-tribulation rapture theories are all myths and smoke. I challenge anyone to find one scripture to support a pre tribulation rapture. happy hunting but you will not find any because there aren't any.
John S. (ps. I am not part of the threshing floor crowd)

8/22/10, 1:08 PM  
Blogger Cathy Palmer said...

Hi John S,
I prefer to say resurrection rather than rapture to eliminate confusion.

Thanks for stopping by and for the comment!

Cathy

8/22/10, 2:43 PM  
Blogger truebeliever2012 said...

First ressurection does not necessarily meaning timing...as it could refer to TYPE. There will be the resurrection to eternal life and then the resurrection to eternal punishment.

Also, you mentioned the church of laodocia, what about the church of Philadelphia where Christ says He will keep them from the hour of testing that is to come upon the whole world.

Also, the church is mentioned only in the beginning and end of the book of revelation...why?

Also, if every is saved after the tribulation, we all get new bodies and never sin again, who populated the millennial kingdom? Who does Satan come out to deceive once he is unbound after a thousand years.

Finally, if we are not raptures...what Was Pail talking about in Thessalonias...being caught up. and if we are caught up AFTER the tribulation, why would God bring us immediately back with Him when lands on the mount of Olives? What's the up and down for.

Thanks

2/17/12, 12:46 AM  
Blogger truebeliever2012 said...

Sorry for the misspelled response previously submitted. Autocorrect is killing me :-) CORRECTED RESPONSE BELOW with additional questions:

First resurrection does not necessarily mean timing...as it could refer to TYPE. There will be the resurrection to eternal life and then the resurrection to eternal punishment.

Also, you mentioned the church of Laodocia, what about the church of Philadelphia where Christ says He will keep them from the hour of testing that is to come upon the whole world. What is this hour of testing?

Also, the church is mentioned only in the beginning and end of the book of revelation...why not the middle during all of the judgements?

Also, if everyone is saved after the tribulation, we all get new bodies and never sin again, who populates the millennial kingdom? Who does Satan come out to deceive once he is unbound after a thousand years.

Finally, if we are not raptured...what Was Paul talking about in Thessalonias...being caught up. and if we are caught up AFTER the tribulation, why would God bring us immediately back with Him when He lands on the mount of Olives? What's the up and down for. Christ said He is going to prepare a place for us, that where He is we may be also? Where is this place. The millennial kingdom is on earth, not in heaven.

Thanks

2/17/12, 1:03 AM  
Blogger Cathy Palmer said...

I also believed the same as you for many years. Then the Lord Jesus opened my eyes to the error and deception I thought was truth.

Read the information here: http://www.poweredbychrist.com/Pretrib_Rapture_Dishonesty.html

The Holy Spirit will direct you.

My prayer continues to be may the Truth be revealed, may the lies be exposed, may the deceived wakeup, may the sinner repent, may the lost get saved and may the Lord Jesus Christ be glorified.

Seeing Truth with you,
Cathy

2/17/12, 6:31 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Jesus is SPIRIT. WE (the church) must worship Jesus in spirit. Talk talk talk. The churches want to teach about ( who said what). Jesus Said (it is finished.) Talk will get you nowhere. It is finished. It is your decision to choose. It is either finished or talk talk talk.When a book is written there is an ending.Choose = talk talk talk like the serpent? The tree of knowledge,and not look at the other side the tree of life? The truth?

3/23/12, 9:54 PM  
Blogger Eric said...

This article is rather poorly written. It cites ambiguous scriptures that have little to do with the rapture question and projects the post trib theory onto it.

How about you examine a few scriptures that actually address the rapture? No need to go into long convoluted explanations they speak for themselves:

Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.
Luke 21:36 (KJV)

Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.
Revelation 3:10 (KJV)

2/3/13, 10:51 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Read "Exposing Satan's Left Behind".

3/16/13, 6:54 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

My name is Alan Finch. Jesus became my Lord and Saviour in April of 1976.

In 2010, I wrote an article "About the Rapture" and I e-mailed the article to approximately 75 websites that teach that there is a Pre-Tribulation Rapture. Many of these websites are major websites.with well known names that have written books, etc. on the subject. Only 2 sites responded back to me with an e-mail, and they did not even bother to address the biblical passage of Scripture that I used for my proof of a no Pre-Tribulation Rapture! I will now share the article.

In the book of Daniel, there is a passage of Scripture which upon careful examination will give the reader a good understanding that a "Pre-Tribulation Rapture of the Saints" (a catching away) does not take place. Since the Bible devotes a great deal of attention to the End-Times, it is pretty clear that this is of "GREAT IMPORTANCE" to the Lord, because HE wants the End-Time Saints to be fully aware of what awaits them, which will help prepare them for the "GREAT DECEPTION" and the "FIERY TRIAL" which is to come. So, understanding that there is no "Pre-Tribulation Rapture" is of MONUMENTAL IMPORTANCE to the End-Time Saint!

Daniel 7:21 - I beheld, and the same "HORN" made war with the Saints, and prevailed against them:
Daniel 7:22 - Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the Saints of the Most High; and the time came that the Saints possessed the kingdom.

We are clearly told in this passage of Scripture, that war is made with the Saints "UNTIL" Christ comes back, at which time judgment is then given to the Saints and then they will possess the Kingdom.

There has been much confusion and different viewpoints in the Church about when is "THE RAPTURE" (the catching away) going to take place. Daniel 7:21 does not tell us that "WAR" is made with those who become Saints after "THE RAPTURE" (the catching away) of earlier Saints (Pre-Tribulation Saints). This verse and the following verse, just simply tells us that "WAR" will be made with the Saints "UNTIL" the return of Christ. .

I want to strongly re-emphasize the point that WE ARE NOT BEING TOLD in verse 21 that the "HORN" makes WAR with those who become Saints after "THE RAPTURE" (the catching away) of previous Saints. If that were the case, because of how "MONUMENTAL" this event is going to be, the Lord would have clearly stated this, so that there would be no room for confusion. In fact, if there is to be a "Pre-Tribulation Rapture", I find id to be a GREAT MYSTERY as to why the Lord would not have given us at least 1 passage of Scripture that is worded in such a way as to clearly state that the "antichrist" makes "WAR" with those who become Saints "AFTER" the "CATCHING AWAY" of earlier Saints. The above passage of Scripture certainly would have given the Lord a "ROYAL OPPORTUNITY" to have clearly stated that there will first be a "CATCHING AWAY" of the Saints, and then the "HORN" makes WAR with those who become Saints during the "Great Tribulation". From the Book of Genesis to the Book of Revelation, we find no such passage of Scripture that states this. God is not the author of confusion!

11/11/14, 9:04 AM  
Blogger Cathy Palmer said...

Well said! Thank you Alan for your comment based on Scripture.

Btw, I was born again in July of 1976 - it was GREAT year :)

Short vid of my story: http://youtu.be/ANm1qNoBFAQ

11/11/14, 9:58 AM  
Blogger Cathy Palmer said...

Also Alan, I forwarded your comment to a few folks and here are a couple of replies:

"Good job! We agree completely and find this heretical teaching to be very harmful to those who just think they will be fine and will not be ready for that horrible tribulation that will come. It is trial by fire often that prepares the believer for what is to come and if we hide away in the walls of our local church and think that nothing but "blessing" is ours in this day, we will be unhappily surprised and probably spiritually unprepared." KG

"Daniel 7:21 - I beheld, and the same "HORN" made war with the Saints, and prevailed against them:
Daniel 7:22 - Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the Saints of the Most High; and the time came that the Saints possessed the kingdom.
We are clearly told in this passage of Scripture, that war is made with the Saints "UNTIL" Christ comes back, at which time judgment is then given to the Saints and then they will possess the Kingdom.
Amen Cathy, thanks for this. Many teach this has already happened." CD

11/11/14, 11:30 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hi Cathy,
This is Alan Finch. Thank you for your response to my article "About the Rapture". When I click on to your section that says e-mail, I am not able to get in. I am hoping that you will be willing to e-mail me your e-mail address. My e-mail address is (candy33alan@aol.com).

I am getting ready to send you another comment in regards to another topic. Thank you

11/11/14, 1:52 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Alan, "the saints" in Daniel are not the church saints. This was written to the Jews. (The church age had not yet come.) There will be 144,000 Jews that will be sealed. They turn to Christ as their Messiah and do not take the mark of the beast. They will go through the 7 year tribulation. They are also virgins and repopulate the earth during the millennial reign of Christ here on earth.

6/7/16, 12:47 AM  

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